I'm with you, Jormegrund, on Bob still being shady. He seems to have a God complex if nothing else, deciding who gets to keep their powers and who doesn't, and then locking people up indefinitely. I don't see him taking away his own power lol. That one can be the most dangerous of all. Money, especially gold, is the root of all evil.
On another note, it definitely looks like Insider's spoilers are proving to be true at this point, so to bring the thread back on topic, it doesn't sound like HRG will die. He'll be imprisoned, possibly by the company because he knows so much, or possibly by the conventional authorities for various murders. Either way, what could that last picture mean now? It definitely looks like he'll be shot, but maybe not killed, and Claire's blood will heal him. There have been people shot in the head who lived, but in the eye? I don't know. Seems strange. I think it would be silly if Claire's blood could raise the dead. Way to Deus ex Machina for my tastes.
(for those who may not know, "Deus ex Machina" is a term for when writers write themselves into a hole and have God come save the day pretty much, or some other scenario that is unbelievable in our world, not to say that God doesn't save the day from time to time, it's just cheap storytelling and a cop-out)
Kring clearly stated (specifically in reference to the HRG painting) that not all paintings have turned out they way they seem.
There are two paths this painting can take, IMO:
1) HRG is shot in the eye with either a bullet, or with Elle's electricity. West flies Claire away so they aren't harmed either. Bob heals HRG with Claire's blood, but sends the Butlers an urn of ashes to make it seem like they are HRG's, and then:
a) either Claire is kept in the dark about HRG being healed or
b) she is brought back to The Company and told her father is alive, but in prison, and can only see him if she co-operates.
or
2) The Company has somehow harnessed Maury and his ability to create the nightmare of HRG dead on the ground in order to throw Claire off-guard.
Right now, I'm either going with choice 1 and option b (because spoilers indicate that in episode 11:
H.R.G. is in a cell of a sort. So unless the 'alternate ending' they filmed has changed, H.R.G. being in episode 11 means that it really can't be his remains in the urn. H.R.G. heads back to his cell. H.R.G. works on Elle, Bob has Claire problems. Disappointed Bob benches Elle. Source: SpoilerTV
or choice B. I get the sense that Claire will find out HRG is alive after thinking he is dead.
Thoughts?
Last edited by popkorn615 on Tue Nov 13, 2007 7:42 pm; edited 2 times in total
Kring clearly stated (specifically in reference to the HRG painting) that not all paintings have turned out they way they seem.
There are two paths this painting can take, IMO:
1) HRG is shot in the eye with either a bullet, or with Elle's electricity. West flies Claire away so they aren't harmed either. Bob heals HRG with Claire's blood, but sends the Butlers an urn of ashes to make it seem like they are HRG's, and then:
a) either Claire is kept in the dark about HRG being healed or
b) she is brought back to The Company and told her father is alive, but in prison, and can only see him if she co-operates.
or
2) The Company has somehow harnessed Maury and his ability to create the nightmare of HRG dead on the ground in order to throw Claire off-guard.
Right now, I'm either going with choice 1 and option b (because spoilers indicate that in episode 11:
H.R.G. is in a cell of a sort. So unless the 'alternate ending' they filmed has changed, H.R.G. being in episode 11 means that it really can't be his remains in the urn. H.R.G. heads back to his cell. H.R.G. works on Elle, Bob has Claire problems. Disappointed Bob benches Elle. Source: SpoilerTV
or choice B. I get the sense that Claire will find out HRG is alive after thinking he is dead.
Thoughts?
I too like the first option, but I'm not quite sure if Claire will find out he's still alive right away. She looks genuinely crushed in that photo where she's holding the urn. The main reason I like this idea is that we've already seen what Adam's blood did for Nathan, and the preview shows Claire getting stuck with a needle to have her blood drawn. So all in all, .
Also, with West as a new friend, I wouldn't see Claire being too cooperative with the company in giving them her blood unless the life of someone she loves (HRG) is on the line. So it might all be a ploy by Bob to get her blood.
Wait -- there is a Claire for Elle exchange, during which HRG and the Haitian and Bob and Mohinder are alive. It's foregone conclusion the "URN" scene happens in Episode # 10, while HRG is held captive in Episode # 11. I expect the showdown is either in Episode #9 or #10.
Now, why would Maury Parkman be involved since the only person that can unlock him from his nightmare is Matt?
Also, it seems to me that HRG would at least have a handle on this situation, don't you? If the situation deteriorates, I can see it going this way: The company MUST TAKE OUT the Haitian who can suppress abilities. He's the one that gets shot and killed. With the Haitian down, Elle can shoot electricity.
And maybe, he (the Haitian) can not be cured by Claire's blood because he already has Mohinder's antibodies in his blood (from when Mohinder saved him in Haiti) -- that's just speculation on my part....
Now, why would Maury Parkman be involved since the only person that can unlock him from his nightmare is Matt?
Also, it seems to me that HRG would at least have a handle on this situation, don't you? If the situation deteriorates, I can see it going this way: The company MUST TAKE OUT the Haitian who can suppress abilities. He's the one that gets shot and killed. With the Haitian down, Elle can shoot electricity.
Well, it's confirmed that
HRG does not get killed so
so logically, the only two explanations for the photo at the moment are that he is shot, killed, and healed with Claire's blood, or Maury is creating a nightmare.
As for your Haitian-getting-killed explanation... I like it! It's also been confirmed that
Elle shoots electricity at Claire, but hits West instead... how else would she use her power unless The Haitian is 'put down.'
After much thinking, Herc, I'm beginning to warm up to your theory about the 8th painting being a fake.
Here are my thoughts... if it was planted, then it probably has to do with somebody who knows Claire and her ability, or that she at least has one. Why? Because what would have happened if the painting was not revealed? HRG would have not gone on this journey. And what did his journey do - I think it left an opening for Claire to be potentially unguarded. But The Company wasn't really concerned with Claire until Niki contracted the incurable strain of the virus. So WHO else wanted Claire? I'll give you a hint... her name is:
Grandma
I think Angela could have planted this painting in order to take HRG away from the family so that her hired FLYER could get closer to her and bring her back to the Petrelli's. Yes, I'm talking about West, NOT Nathan. Furthermore, how could Angela have known where to slip the painting so that Mohinder would conveniently find it? Through The Haitian. The Haitian teamed up with Mohinder before the painting was found.
Personlly, I don't like the fact that in this season, Angela hasn't mentioned Claire at all, when in the Season finale, she was trying to do everything in her power to keep her from stopping the explosion.
Actually, if that's the case, some facts in the season start to make more sense, and I am warming up to my theory as modified by you even more.
That would of course imply even more (as we have assumed from the first) that Angela has some sort of pre-cognitive ability in conjunction with other mind-powers.
But my main thrust is this: West would seem to work for Angela.... So, if HRG "bagged and tagged" him, and Angela worked for the company, who's to say that Angela did not recruit him?
Well, it's confirmed that
HRG does not get killed so
so logically, the only two explanations for the photo at the moment are that he is shot, killed, and healed with Claire's blood, or Maury is creating a nightmare.
Why is everyone dancing around the obvious? Maury isn't the only person who has the ability to create a nightmare; Matt can, too. Matt appears to be in league with the Company now (especially since Mohinder has been pulled in). Matt knows how to create a nightmare, as he has already done so for his father. Because his abilities are not that refined, it may be all he can do. He may put Claire into a nightmare where she sees HRG die and has his ashes while (in the real world) they are transporting her to draw her blood for the vaccine. She may be putting up a fight and that is the only way they can get her to come.
I don't think Matt is doing it, but I don't really think the nightmare option is valid, either, so if one is going to go with it, go all the way...
I don't think Matt has the ability to create "nightmares" like Maury can; not yet anyway. The "nightmare" Maury's trapped in is his own; Matt just stumbled across a way to pull Maury into it. I think Matt will be frightened to even explore that aspect of his power, for fear of becoming just like his dad. I mean, how do you practice something like that? "Hey, let me manipulate your brain for a few." Doesn't really fit in with his current "good guy" image, lol.
Well, it's confirmed that
HRG does not get killed so
so logically, the only two explanations for the photo at the moment are that he is shot, killed, and healed with Claire's blood, or Maury is creating a nightmare.
Why is everyone dancing around the obvious? Maury isn't the only person who has the ability to create a nightmare; Matt can, too. Matt appears to be in league with the Company now (especially since Mohinder has been pulled in). Matt knows how to create a nightmare, as he has already done so for his father. Because his abilities are not that refined, it may be all he can do. He may put Claire into a nightmare where she sees HRG die and has his ashes while (in the real world) they are transporting her to draw her blood for the vaccine. She may be putting up a fight and that is the only way they can get her to come.
I don't think Matt is doing it, but I don't really think the nightmare option is valid, either, so if one is going to go with it, go all the way...
I'm not dancing around the obvious, Hatcher. Yes, Matt can create nightmares too (he brought Maury into his own nightmare, Stone, and it's been confirmed by Bob that Maury and Matt have the same ability). However, Hatcher, it's also been confirmed that
Matt will be with Nathan dealing with Hiro, Adam, and Peter. The two major plot scenes for upcoming episodes involve:
1) HRG, Claire, West, Elle, Bob, Mohinder, Molly, and Sylar (and maybe The Haitian too)
and separately
2) Matt, Nathan, Hiro, Peter, and Adam
There is a very good chance that Matt will not be involved with the Claire/Elle scenario, so he won't be the one to create the 'nightmare' in the 8th painting, if the 8th painting is indeed a nightmare.
Matt is not involved with it. As PK stated he's off doing something else.
I believe Claire with the URN of ashes is not a nightmare either. I believe she's holding "the Haitian's" ashes. He was important to both her and her father.
Matt's going to be off tracking down the surviving members of the 12 according to spoilers, isn't he? He's going to be playing detective and trying to piece together what really happened with the original 12 most likely. Either way, I haven't heard any mention of him being at the Elle/Claire tradeoff scene.
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